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By Tyrael, I just made a 2 page long topic and the site screw me over. I don't have the patience to rewrite everything, but all I can tell you is - judging by the current standards of the D3 attribute system - I'm actually happy that they currently plan to make it automatic.
I mean, COME ON?! Health Globe bonus for willpower? Where is the creativity?! Maybe I'm being a bit too rude, but I'm just so frustrated - the game will be great, but it saddens me that developers these days, even Blizzard, skips a few months of work on an excellent system with great attributes that means something to every class - no matter where you put it, to instead work on ..well, I don't really know what they do instead of this, but I rather have them release the game 3 months later, or even a year later than scheduled if they just could make every attribute mean something to my character - all of them, not just one.
While Diablo has always been about the simpleness of things, and having a stat distribution system would certainly have to be limited, I still believe it would be far better than having no way for the player to manually assign the points himself.
Blizzard have the answer to a new type of attributesystem right in front of them. They've made their skilltree into several different tiers - what's stopping them from doing the same with the attributes? Other than a creative mind; nothing whatsoever.
Let me share with you what I mean:
All 4 attributes have 5 different tiers - each tier adding new kind of enhancements for every point put in after you've crossed the line and breached into a new tier.
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Dexterity:
Tier 1 - Starts at character base Dexterity: Each point put into dexterity affects chance to hit an enemy foe.
Tier 2 - Starts at 65 Dexterity: Each point put into dexterity affects the chance to avoid melee hits and the attack speed.
Additionally, the enhancement from tier 1 remain and now also yield even higher chance to hit an enemy foe per point of dexterity.
Tier 3 - Starts at 135 Dexterity: Each point you put into dexterity affects the chance to parry an melee attack using one or two weapons made of steel/metal/iron.
Additionally, the enhancements from tiers 1 and 2 remain, and the player is yielded an even higher chance to hit an enemy foe, and the chance to dodge melee hits and the attack speed are both also increased, per point of dexterity.
Tier 4 - Starts at 205 Dexterity: Each point put into dexterity now increases the armor of the character, and also transforms the chance to dodge melee attacks, into being able to dodge ranged piercing attacks as well (not magic).
Attack speed, parry speed, chance to hit is further increased per point of dexterity.
Tier 5 - Starts at 320 Dexterity: Each point put into dexterity now transforms the tier 3 ability to parry melee attacks, to parry ranged piercing attacks as well.(Low % per point of dex - countered by the chance to hit if you'd see it from a PvP perspective.)
Armor, attackspeed, chance to avoid melee/ranged hits and chance to hit an enemy foe are all further increased per point of dexterity.
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While I do know, this Dexterity Attribute-tree is really only good for melee types of characters or even ranged archers - the fact remains that it could be heavily tweaked by a creative mind. This was only an example from my part, and do keep in mind that it's very basic and that I am tired.
The idea basically was to remake the attribute system in Diablo 3, to a more revolutionary kind of system - much more similar to that of their skillsystem - only that it is a skillsystem of its own.
Depending on the feedback on my idea - I might post my thoughts for the other attribute-trees, which I did post until the site asked me to log in and erased my cache.
So, thoughts? (Try to ignore the rant in the beginning - I was frustrated, and I'm not ashamed of showing it.)
Bashiok: Thanks for the thread and I wanted to say I do appreciate the time and effort and ideas being put in to coming up with solutions for topics that are important to you. I want to try to put the idea of auto attribute allocation, the topic of this thread, in a potentially different light though. Potentially.
It seems there are really only a few core problems for those that do take issue with auto attributes when you boil it down. The loss of a customization option and the ability to create builds for characters that are apart from the norm - or even just kind of crazy and experimental. Some other issues could be a loss of a “leveling achievement” and also just the classic RPG design of manually spending points on base stats. Sort of a nostalgia issue, but still valid in its own right.
So I’ll sort of tackle these each on their own and then hopefully give you some things to think about.
First is the loss of customization, and I’ve mentioned before that we don’t think it will be an issue, but let me elaborate a bit more. With the current skill system, runes, and item affixes, as well as other unmentionables, there’s not going to be any issue with not having enough customization. If there is, bottom line, we’ll add more. We’re not going to release a game we’re not happy with, and a lack of character customization options would make us unhappy. But, even right now we have a lot more variety and ability to customize a character than Diablo II had. I’m going to come back to some of this later because we’d like your help.
Somewhat similarly is being able to create “off-spec” builds, or characters that aren’t just cookie cutter ideals of the class you’re playing. This is important to the game, and we will ensure that it doesn't get "tuned out" of the game. Most importantly though being able to manually spend attributes does not make this a possibility. Which is to say that us automatically assigning attributes does not take away the ability to make these types of characters, at all. Manual attributes were not what made them possible in Diablo II. The ability to make these types of characters relies solely on the complexity and diversity of the the options available to steer your character, and not that they come in the form of a "+" button.
The loss of a feeling of a leveling achievement is actually something we recognize and intend to address.
The nostalgia of simply having points, and spending them on base stats is probably the most difficult. Liking something because it’s familiar is difficult to argue with, but it’s also probably the easiest to overcome. Since we can’t force your memories out of you, we just have to make the best game we can and hope you realize that manual attribute assignment isn’t the best, most engaging or entertaining form of character customization possible, and that we’re offering an even deeper and richer game without those buttons. Or you’ll just forget you even cared because you're playing Diablo III and it's totally kick ass... one or the other.
Back to the part where I said we’d like your help. We want a lot of items in the game, and with that we want to have a lot of affixes. The largest pool of character-focusing mojo is coming from your items, so we plan to have a very diverse selection. While we have been and continue to come up with as many affixes as we can we’d like some help from you guys in coming up with more. We have some pretty crazy stuff already but I don’t want to influence your creativity - plus when it’s one we already have and it goes in to the game you can tell all your friends it was your idea. So if you'd like somewhere to focus your creative energy, this is the place.
That aside I know I missed some specific concerns and points, so any follow up questions are welcome. Being Friday I’ll try to get to some today but they may have to wait until next week. 作者: wu594769994 时间: 2009-10-11 08:36
